Is your age against you?

Allen, you sound like a revolutionary! (I’m all for revolution of course, as long as things actually turn out better with better people on top and everything working well). However, the alternatives have already proven to have been far far worse and remove incentive to be the best. So far only capitalism seems to promote this enough for people to put in the effort. I am definitely not putting up with my job if I don’t have to and I’m definitely not doing my job if it only pays the same as easier jobs. I’d do the easier jobs instead and concentrate my attention on my family and enjoying our lives instead.

All too often, Degrees etc. are used by “employers” as justification for chosing a specific candidate. However, I have been in a situation where the “degree” bore NO relation to the job in question. The examples I experienced were an Art Degree and a History Degree, the two employees in question were working in an IT dept as engineers! I also heard of someone with a Music degree being employed in a local government post dealing with accounts! I have always worked in Electrical and Electronics and had an interest and Hobby in IT, so why can’t I get a job in IT now? I’m too old, one look at my CV and a little guesswork, my application is turned down. If i were to hide my age by the clever use of words, then at the face to face interview, my Silver-Grey hair seals the rejection letter which arrives on the mat a reasonable week later, that’s if they even bother to send one. Grumpy old man, yes and proud to be able to say so. When employers and interviewers lose the “I don’t want to employ him/her, because they might be after my job or know more than I do about the job” ethos, then maybe, just maybe, the best person might be offered the job. I think that’s about all from me, unless prospective employers are willing to offer me a job, which i doubt as I tend to speak my mind and not be the ubiquitous “YES MAN”

For the ones interested here one blog about discrimination http://michaelspiro.wordpress.com/
Those plus other recruitment questions were asked to me too.

I expect you all to be independent, innovative, critical thinkers who will do exactly as I say.

Michael Spiro is spot on, and we thank him for his blog on age discrimination.
What I would say to these small minded organisations is they are the loosers cause even if a senior manager gives them just 2 years of their experience that will make a difference, tap into their knowledge and experience it is by far more beneficial than recruiting someone younger who will probably leave the company after 2 years! thats how it is…. the outside world is tempting they will certainly go after better career prospects, higher salary to fulfil their aspirations. As for these Managers that speak behind closed door giving specific briefs to recruiters when recruiting for them – well how old are you Mr HR, IT Manager\Director, etc… dont you think you are passed your sell out date… of course you are, dare you leave your companies if you can ! ! dont think so as you will also be unemployable, too old, past it, shame on you.

I’m always a little intigued – even by the Pro arguments that say ‘I can provide knowledge and experience’ – as to why someone older would get turned down for a job in favour of someone younger. For no other reason alone, I would say that a virtual guarantee of at least turning up every day would be a benefit for any employer. The mindset of someone older and their responsibility towards their client / employer must be worth a lot in terms of company stability and growth surely?

PJ you missed the point about employers not wanting to be “outshone” by an employee, especially an older one and young ones are more “Malleable” if you get my drift. Another point is that the old adage “You can’t teach an old dog new tricks” can be a very persuasive influence, and yes I do know that someone older can pick up new tricks, My last conract employment required me to do several new tasks in addition to my more usual ones and I managed to do them. Another example of this was an ex military Warrent Officer who became a Civil Servant working in the same environment. He had to work at just over the same payrate as the most junior military person and take instructions from someone he probably had under his command when he was that W.O. So older and more mature workers can be of benefit industry, all we need is for some emploers to get their head from out of whatever particular orifice they have secreted it and accept that we are not old dodderers and are not steeped in the past. I’m 64 and have 10MB broadband, a dual core 2.13GHz 3GB RAM widescreen laptop and I set it up. I intend to add a wireless printer, so I’ll need a WPS router, so I still keep up-to-date.
Bob

The government has started the process of increasing the years before pension is payable, this means forget retiring at age 60 years old; what are the employers going to do!! get rid people of 60+ – there are double standards here, one for the government and the other is the hidden agenda the employers have. Forget the lip service dished out by organisations, in their world older employees means they have past it no potential! how wrong they are, blinkered to say the least. The old age can’t be stopped, sooner or later everyone will get there and when they do they will too understand the age is just a number.

Here is wishing everyone a Merry Christmas and a Happy, Healthy, Prosperous New year.
Peace on Earth.

The agencies are the best placed to know whether there is age discrimination or not, they know what their clients are really asking for. I have certainly witnessed it in the distant past, where in one project I worked, the manager who took over put a request for systems analysts and declared he wanted them all under 30. In the end the two recruits were both in their forties because no one younger he could find had the requisite skills. the clown himself was sacked some months later when he tried playing office politics against the uber boss and was sacked for it.

Well the city is full of age related problems shall we say, Companies and Businesses want graduates with work experience, but when your graduate and you try to find work experience, you can’t get it because you can’t afford it or you don’t fall within the age bracket they are looking for. So you are dammed if you do and dammed if you don’t.
I got friends with degrees and they are older than me in their forties and can’t get work. The quicker we get a government who can stand up against businesses the better, otherwise we are going to have a nation of graduates unemployed doing nothing till they are sixty.

Well said James, I agree with you. But to be honest, you have been so long with your feet under the desk and your head down over the keyboard that you are a long way behind the game regarding government and “business”. You remember “privatisation”, that “democraric process” that took place a few years ago? Well, you see, that was lhe last gasp of political power. That was when (while you and millions of others were heads down at your keyboards) the people who own western capitalism (i.e. the owners of the only real power, economic power) bought the assets of western governments all over the world, removing for all time any government access to economic power and reducing governments to tugging at fetlocks and doffing their hats in a “punch and judy show” run by their masters and managed on their behalf by a compliant mainstream media. This leaves the likes of us to occupy ourselves with no higher horizon than to squabble over discrimination in access to the crumbs falling from the table and whose turn it is to take out the garbage. Personally, I think it’s a sad condition to be in, but given that it seems to be acceptable to even the most well-educated and privileged upper-middle-class who have forgotten that they do actually “Work for a Living” and even some aristocrats at the lower end of the Loyds’ names ladder, the likes of you and I might as well talk to the wall. Good luck James.

Yup, over 40 over the hill, ripe for the knackers yard.
Strangely the very same companies that won’t employ you because of your age are looking for candidates with donkeys years of experience. Let me assure them that even with the strangeness of the industry it is just not plausible that a 25 year old will have 20 years of real IT delivery experience.
More sensibly, those of us who are greybearded over 40’s have made all the mistakes that 25 year old will make, we have learnt , and we are not yet so senile as we will want to repeat them. And when we grumble around saying ‘in the good old days my PC used to be able to start in seconds, closed when you tripped the power button, and could start a word processor in a fraction of the time it takes word to stumble into action, could process 20 people on one 80286 and only required 640k of ram to actually perform several useful tasks at the same time” its worth listening to us, we are right, and because we can still remember how we did that we can still write efficient code – so when you want a mobile phone operating system written that allows you to switch on and make a 999 call before the robber has died of old age perhaps you should ask us – the youngsters seem to think we all have 30 years to wait while enough object libraries to run several space craft load up….

So good for Gordon Brown’s Age Discrimination Policy ??

Couldn’t agree more, even with the new laws on age discrimination there is still plenty of it out there, but just try to prove it. If you try you get called a trouble maker and blacklisted. It’s about time we had a government for the people, which is what parliament was created for, to protect the people from bad leaders, instead of puppets for business.

When I applied for a job with a retail outlet I did get an email back saying “Sorry We Only Hire 16yr olds for sales assistants, I wish I had kept that email now. I was so angry with the response at the time I deleted it, but surely if companies who post jobs with the words Junior, isn’t that discrimination because once you turn 16 you are of working age whether they its a junior position or not ?

I know ho you all must feel . I am over 40 and David Hitchman my husband up there .. left me and our son for a young Russian woman .. so hey your age did not matter there ! but unfortunately I was canned and my son left without a father … soyes Dave i was put out to pasture

That’s right James – as soon as I see words like “Junior” or “Graduate” I know it will be a waste of time making an effort on those jobs. At 53 – too young to retire I’ve got at least those 12 years left in me – and companies should realise that they will get 12 years’ worth out of me – and that includes Monday mornings ! They won’t need to worry about training and me leaving once I’ve got the new skills … I do wonder about the role of recruitment agencies in this whole “supply chain” – they appear to be the people “Playing God” with our futures – preventing the people who “can do” and “will do” from actually “doing” …

You wonder what companies are hiring these recruitment companies, and whether these companies are functioning as well as what they should if they were to spend a little time actually doing their own recruitment. Also I have noticed that some of these companies are asking for skills in graduates they are never gonna get because they don’t teach them at any university in this country…

There are several issues against me, most of them caused by HR or recruitment agencies ….
a) Age, not only is 45 considered over the hill (not a source of much wide experience) but it also means I know what a ‘living wage’ is in the UK, and how much profit is being skimmed off in bosses bonuses, I am therefore too experienced to want to do 60 hours a week for £20k a year.
b) Experience, years of programming and management experience are completely worthless, or actually against you, unless it happens to be in ‘bank trading’ (the only non MOD recruitment in the UK). If you have done 6 months in a bank its worth far more than 25 years in the IT industry. You certainly can’t even get an interview without the 6 months
c) Actually its pointless worrying about it anyway, within the next 5 years IT will be another old industry that has left the UK for good – more than half of it is already in India and China.Even our own government would rather pay Indians to develop the NHS system (or rather not develop it) than pay anyone in the UK.

I thought that the NHS software was Aussie, mind you, they haven’t been able to get their security sorted until this year,esp. laptops and Memory sticks and other media. Keep plugging away, someone somewhere values experience and is willing to pay a decent salary, it’s just a matter of finding it, not easy took me 14 months just for my 2 month contract! Good luck

It’s remarkable how prized ‘experience in financial trading’ is, given where all the financial trading of the last twenty-five years has left the entire world economy. If the government had a backbone it would make it law that no-one who had ever worked inside that industry should ever be employed in it again.

Breaking news, I got a contract IT job at 64, yes I did have to hold on to my zimmer so that I didn’t fall over. But that’s not why I’m writing this. I got the job through an Agency as 2nd choice as the first guy had some issues he didn’t last long, I wasn’t there when he was so I can’t comment. I started the “urgent” job without being in possession of a written contract. The point was that the Agency didn’t make it clear that the pay would be 4 weekly, I expected weekly. So I give them a call and get excuses that the “hiring” company hadn’t paid the Agency so they couldn’t pay me. I’m too old for that trick, I cut and pasted from the direct.gov.uk website the summarised legislation about the Agency has a responsibility to pay the contractor (me) even when the Hirer hasn’t paid the Agency (The 2 contracts are separate entities legally). I was talking to a very well mannered young man, must be young as I retire this year and I’m sure Agencies don’t let “oldies” do employment consultancy! Any way as I was talking to him, the call was taken over by a very abrupt voice who refused to say what his position with the Agency was except that he was able to say (shout really) that he was not taking the liabilty of paying me until the Hirer paid them and he had the authority to take me off site. He ought to read employment law… After the 4 weeks, the contract arrived via e-mail and was also sent off to the company doing my pay (umbrella company). The umbrella Co. queried the contract wanting small amendments and requested an update to the Agency’s details. It goes on and on and on. The only winners so far are the Hirer, getting the job done and the Agency, getting paid and subsequently holding on to my money by not co-operating with the Umbrella Co. Thus Umbrella and myself are the losers so far. I will let you know how it goes, as I said in my very first comment, I’m a “Grumpy Old Man” and proud of it, I will not be steam-rollered into keeping quiet or submit silently to continued abuse, I shall be making an official complaint and probably contacting ACAS to see if I can claim for unfair or illegal treatment by the Agency. The Hirer is being very supportive by the way and the Agency may find themselves blacklisted by the Hirer! I wish I could give more detail, but Agency, Hirer and Umbrella Co must remain anonymous for now, but at least I got a job, although I didn’t think it was going to be Voluntary or Charitable.

It would be far more use to the rest of us if you told us who the agency, employer and umbrella company, then we can all avoid them like the plague they are.

I can’t tell you as yet, its only the Agency causing delays no matter what they say to me. I keep getting “communications” which would make apolitician proud. Talk about issue dodging! I don’t want to name the Umbrella or the Hirer, they are both “trustworthy”, I’ve worked twice for the Hirer (not exactly the same but Trusts within the NHS, so no problems there at all) through other agencies and not had any trouble and I have used the Umbrella before and know others who have used them, so they have a good reputation, so I don’t want to associate them with my issues and the Agency. My difficulties seem to be related just to the Agency and I am unwilling to mention their name until I can be sure that I am justified and within the law. If I can, then I will at a later date. Meanwhile, make sure that you get your contract or terms of reference in writibg BEFORE you start working for the Agency and don’t accept excuses even if it means missing a potential job, if they really want you, then they will oblige.

@Bob, first congrats for the role. Second thank God for the “Grumpy Old Pa”. We “youngsters” need to get more advices from a person like you. Nice inside about the legislation. So this means I can sue or give the finger to the Agency if they do not fulfil their part of the contract? Basically the time-sheets, either weekly or monthly, have to be paid to the Employer by the Agency (within a week?) whether the Hirer pays them? So is this enforced by the law? How? I AM ASKING A QUESTION TO ALL THE LAYERS READING THIS TREAD. It would be nice if at least one among the hundreds lawyers that read this tread would comment to this “extremely common” Agency way to operate.

To answer your question, go to http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Employment/Employees/EmploymentContractsAndConditions/DG_10027514
and download a simplified leaflet at http://www.direct.gov.uk/prod_consum_dg/groups/dg_digitalassets/@dg/@en/@employ/documents/digitalasset/dg_172492.pdf,
finally to complain about them to the BERR, http://www.berr.gov.uk/whatwedo/employment/employment-agencies/page27003.html
these last two are linked from the first one. The due payment time is set by the you – Agency contract, however, I would assume that any agency witholding payment beyond the contracted pay dates (mine ended up as 4 weekly paymnents because I pointed it out and I hadn’t got weekly in writing,) and now they have to amend details on that contract for the Umbrella, it gives them another excuse to delay. I think that this is unfair, but because I use an Umbrella company, then maybe it’s their job to chase invoices. Well they have to pay me as I believe that they are claseed as an employment business, we will see what happens. The main point is, if your work is satisfactory to the hirer, then the Agency has to pay you, the You – Agency Contract is a completely separate entity to the Agency – Hirer Contract, thus whatever the current state of the Agency – Hirer contract, has no impact on the you – Agency one. The you-Agency contract is fixed in law and NOT dependent on any other contracts the Agency might have even when it relates to the Hirer where you are working..

I hope that this helps to clarify it for all levels, but I look forward to any formal legal advice from any “over-the -hill” Solicitors who might be reading this, remember we are talking about British Law, other legisaltions may be more or less Draconian.

Well done Bob. Your story is interesting. Just one thought, the company can hire you direct by dropping the agency. What they need to do is end their recruitment contract with the agency ASAP. The advertise the job [the one you are doing] internally and externally not via any Agency – just apply for it, if they really want you the job will be yours, the advertising will be just a formality. If the job is long term, by cutting out the middle guys it will be a win win for both yourself and the company in question. If this job is not long term e.g. for 3 months, I would forget it, move on and do something else, the hussle is just not worth it… The company is supportive but how! the only way is to get you working for them direct.

Thanks, but it is only short term and only until the end of March, but it is local and a reasonable pay (which I will get, the legal stuff is already being studied by me). Also I enjoy the company of the other staff.. The big drawback to your suggestion about “ditching” the Agency and working direct, is that the Hirer has to work exactly within the framework of the law and by the time that is acheived, the job will be over. I will still get my money, but boy are they making me wait for it! Maybe I could invoke a legal claim to interest on my lost earnings in a similar manner to overdue Invoice payments, I’ll have to check. Thanks once again, it can be done if you persist, someone will appreciate the experience of an older worker.

@Dave,
Your C Comment is exactly right, there is loads of outsourcing websites out there offering cheaper IT alternatives whether it be in IT Support, Web Development or other programming solutions. We have seen call centres already go so IT will be going that way soon and then u will soon see the economy struggle.

I noticed that Junior Java programmer jobs are almost universally advertised as graduate positions. I don’t have a degree but I do have an SCJP certification.
I am in my forties and have had a career somewhere other than IT development. Now after (the R word!) I want to secure a role as a Java programmer. Can anyone here put a figure on my chances? 80% likelihood of success? 0.0001%? My chief fears are ageism, a rigid requirement for a degree (one example from an advert mentioned a degree from a top-tier redbrick? What on earth does that mean?) and jobs being outsourced. Am I right to be concerned?
Best Paul

You can try here. Best of luck with the job hunt.

@Paul,
There are loads of Java jobs out there, try other IT job boards and professional recruitment companies, also if you know J2EE then you should be able to pick up something quite soon.

Sory Red-Brick means 1 of the top Universities(top 20-30) really, and with Java becoming more and more popular for web architectures you should be able to find something.

I wonder who Sarah Jones works for – could she maybe confirm that recruitment agencies DO NOT have a secret ageism agenda – or is she looking for a cheap advert ………

Hi Mike

I work for The IT Job Board and was just trying to be helpful by including a link to our Java jobs. If I can help someone out and promote The IT Job Board at the same time, why not

Didn’t answer the REAL question mind …..

Hi Mike,

I think Bob’s story proves that if you are the right person for the job, age does not matter. Reading the comments here shows that it is a concern for many IT professionals but whether or not it is a reality I cannot prove. As we are not a recruitment agency I could also not comment, but I am sure there are plenty of recruitment agencies out there that are working hard to get people jobs however old they are.

What’s your opinion then? And tell us about your experiences.

Regards,

Sarah

Sarah

How do you prove you are the right person if your CV and letter get discarded by the office junior who is ticking buzzwords or checking dates?

@sarah,
I think you’re here just to promote your own site, I have applied for countless jobs through your IT job boards only to be contacted by recruiters with there two favourate questions:
1) Have you had any interviews ?
2) Can you give us the names of the companies you have had interviews with ?
Now that does not sound like a recruitment agency who wants to find someone work || That sounds like a recruitment company only interested in looking for other clients.
Does anyone know if there is like a governing body for recruitment agencies to belong or adhere to ?

Hi James,

Yes I am here to promote our site as well as share the latest stats and trends in order to keep people informed of what’s happening in the market.

Unfortunately, as we are not a recruitment consultancy, I cannot comment on the experiences you have had with recruitment consultants.

However we do talk with consultants on a regular basis in order to find out what’s happening in the market from their point of view. I’m fairly sure these are standard questions that consultants ask.

Please follow these links to the governing bodies that I know of:

Association of Professional Staffing Companies (APSCo)
The Recruitment and Employment Confederation (REC)

“Top red-brick university” is pretty meaningless really. Considering that all universities are graded by subject, you’d have thought this would have been worke dout by now, but clearly HR departments are still involved. So, simply put, it means a traditional university, therefore NOT a polytechinc that was converted in the last 20 years. That leaves around 60 or so. On the other hand it also appears to rule out: overseas graduates, open university graduates and rather ironically Oxbridge !
Another point to bear in mind is that HR/agency staff are often too young to understand grade inflation – the assumption they have is that anyone who doesn’t have a 1st must be stupid, because if you are mid twenties then that’s the case. They can’t conceive of the system where only the top 5% go into HE.

In my opinion agencies will only contact a potential candidate when the database picks up certain key words listed in the CV. This proves nothing more that the CV profile may or may not fit-in with the job requirements. As for looking after candidates as individuals that is a myth… all the years I worked in Industry I always managed my own recruitment and have been successful in getting the right jobs – this was not through agencies it was by applying direct for the employer to invite candidates for interviews. What usually happens with agencies they want CV’s to put in front of their customer it is just words and if they like the sound of your experience then just perhaps you may get lucky.. if not it goes in the bin!
Signing on with agencies does not guarantee you a job either the good thing about it, is they know what you look like, thereafter, you are in the hands of the recruiters. There is a huge turnover with recruiters leaving agencies too, so all your hard work with one recruitment consultant goes down the drain once they leave ….need to re-establish again working relationships.. As for the age thing, it does exist, the only time it may not really matter is when temporary or contract work could be on offer otherwise if it is a permanent job they are looking for younger people to grow with the company… I know cause I worked at high level with well known companies !

I said I would keep the blog updated with regard to my employment problems, it’s going wrong again. The employment agency, having been e-mailed fresh copies of the invoices, has found yet another delay in paying me. First of all they “lost” invoices and now they need to get permission to pay them. They were aware of the need to pay them, but they chose to wait until the last moment to chase the permission up and be authorised to pay, in the contract they specified the daily pay rate and have received my weekly timesheets, so they could easily have calculated the amounts and pre-authorised them. I do apologise for not giving you more info about them, but I have no intention of naming names as yet, I don’t want to predjudice any future legal or otherwise action. I can only reiterate, get your contract details BEFORE you start work and get all aspects agreed, in writing and signed. Then you have ammunition to take legal action if they break the agreement. I shall be making a very serious complaint about the lack of responsibility shown by the Agency. The staff at the Agency office will and do all get paid and on time, so why not me? CAB, ACAS and one or two other complaints/disputes agencies, services etc. will be hearing from me. Meanwhile, have a nice day everyone.

Does this agency have other contractors working for them! do you know if they get paid on time. I am surprised why the company you are currently working for are using their services….

Complain about it, what are these agencies names so I can avoid them in the future ?

@James, I intend to complain, but I don’t want them to use it as an excuse to delay payment even further by counter claiming against me. Suffice it to say that I will be complaining in the most ways in which I can.

@Vasoula, Yes they do have other contractors, but I don’t know any of them or whether they get paid. The “hirer” has been aware of my plight ever since the start of the job and have already noted that the Agency will be blacklisted by them and most probably by their associate businesses. They even said that they would be willing to take me on via another, albeit non-IT specialists, Agency who know that they would get paid by the “hirer” and would ensure that their contractors are happy and contented with the service they receive. I have had experience with “hirers” associated with my current one and know that they pay invoices as and when they are due. Needless to say, these contracts were provided by what I call Agencies with integrity and I can say that one was based in Wales and the other on the south coast of England, so there are some good ones. I must wait until tomorrow to see if my current agency (if I can be allowed to call them an Agency) have promised to pay the Umbrella soon, I’m not holding my breath! Watch this page for further updates. Best wishes to you all.

I also want names so I can avoid ever dealing with them.

what are these agencies names so I can avoid them in the future ?

@Hari and James

Either one of you could be associated with the agency in question, so no amount of asking will get me to reveal their name until I’m good and ready, so don’t keep asking, I’m not telling, suffice to say It isn’t in Wales or south of Essex/Bristol line, just follow the previous recommendations and get the contract in writing and agreed, before starting work, then you have full knowledge of terms and conditions etc., and you can use them to ensure that the Agency follows the law as listed on the Direct.gov.uk website. A good Umbrella company also helps, they have a lot of muscle to use if required, or get a good solicitor if things go wrong, I fell into the trap of starting and not getting a written contract first, in law this means that I had accepted the contract and was thus bound by it, although I suppose the unduly lenghty delay in issuing the contract could be used as an arguement in any litigation. I have found out some more details and the situation is more complex than I first thought, although I beleive that the Agency is mainly still to blame . No more comments on this subject please, I will not be blogging for a while..

You shouldn’t have blogged in the first place, if you are not gonna tell us then how are we to know which agencies to trust, the idea of naming them is to help others avoid the same pitfulls you have gone through.

I blogged to help you avoid pitfalls in contracting, not to name and shame an agency. If I was to name them, it might jeopardize any future litigation which I may start or the agency may start against me for (and I can’t remember whether its slander or libel), so again be careful and the you should be OK. As a result of your persistance, I shall now withdraw completely from the blog, I was hoping to be able to give you all the benefit of an experience, but you seem determined to lead me into making a step too far and compromising my future position. Maybe you are an agency man yourself and looking to sue someone, I have absolutely no idea, so you ought not to have asked in the first place. Best wishes and regards and a final goodbaye to you all.

Bob
You are doing the right thing by not revealing now who the agency is etc.
Hey guys, if you are contractors you are obviously doing OK, if not there are lessons to be learned by Bob’s experience. Lets leave it at that…..
Good luck

Long time viewer / first time poster. Really enjoy reading the blog, keep up the excellent work. Will most definitely start posting more oftenin the near future.

Hi All

I know that I said that my last blog was the final one, but fyi, the Agency finally paid up to the Umbrella, mind you this was after a formal complaint about the Agency to the BERR who passed it to the EAS ( Employment Agencies Standards dept. and was officially investigated) and I got my final pay some 7 months after I completed the contract. The Agency is now on the EAS records and any further misbehaviour will lead to even more severe action being taken against them! The EAS followed my complaint up and accepted that I cannot disclose , even to them, how and how much I finally got in my pay. This was after a semi-legal process and I am bound by an agreement, so more specific details will not be given.

I am now retired, but I will continue to watch this blog with interest.

Bob

Well done for following up your complaint and well done for getting the pay you deserve…

Good Luck and happy retirement…